Re: [ARSCLIST] Risk assessment tool--off brands

[David Lennick <dlennick@xxxxxxxxxxxx>]

I seem to be the only one in the world whose only problems with Kodak tape have
involved curling. Fortunately I've had only about a dozen rolls (dating from
the late 60s) and they still play well today. No vinegar syndrome, no
shedding....they didn't seem to take splices well. I still use a 7" Kodak
take-up reel because of its stiff sides..it's the only one that packs thin
tapes smoothly in playing.

In the early 60s, the white-box tape sold around here (Toronto) really WAS
white box, and it came from Soundcraft. 1.5 mil to .5 mil (and eventually
triple-thin), and it probably wore out many a head. There was also an odd brand
sold in Toronto in the early 70s that must have come from every warehouse in
North America..all colours, all formulations, in white boxes labelled "Magnetic
Recording Tape" and $1.29 a reel or less. I'm sure some was Scotch 201 and some
was Soundcrap.

Concertape was the usual Shamrock..some good, some lousy. Like many, I bought
Shamrock in the 60s and 70s because it was cheap and .. er .. cheap. The brown
oxide 1.5 mil tape still plays well today, so it was likely 631. Many of the
other versions including back-coated black oxide 1-mil began to squeal within a
couple of years.

There was one brand of tape sold in Canada that was actually worse than
Shamrock, called Bel-Cleer, and it was also sold in Sam The Record Man's stores
as "Sam's" in ugly orange boxes. The acetate-based tape (especially the 1-mil)
would break if you looked at it. It didn't last long enough to go to
back-coated. And you should see THEIR rejects, which were sold for 50 cents a
reel at TelTronics..sometimes you'd get a reel where the oxide disappeared for
long stretches, sometimes you'd get a roll of half-mil which would be stuck
together even before you used it. Hey, we all had to save money at one time.

dl

"Scott D. Smith" wrote:

> Ditto on the Kodak stock. It also applies to their magnetic films
> stocks. I have a roll of 16mm mag on the shelf at the moment (ca. 1969)
> which has some of the worst shedding I've ever encountered.
>
> I would also throw Concertape into horror pile as well.
>
> --Scott D. Smith
>
> Chicago Audio Works, Inc.
>
> **********************************
>
> Tom Fine wrote:
>
> > Kodak -- very bad. I've had rolls that are already mostly powdered
> > oxide in the box.
> >
> > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steven Smolian" <smolians@xxxxxxxxx>
> > To: <ARSCLIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > Sent: Thursday, January 05, 2006 9:23 AM
> > Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] Risk assessment tool--off brands
> >
> >
> >> Kodak, some of which seems to use a different plastic base.
> >>
> >> Steve Smolian
> >>
> >>
> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Casey, Michael T"
> >> <micasey@xxxxxxxxxxx>
> >> To: <ARSCLIST@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >> Sent: Thursday, January 05, 2006 8:47 AM
> >> Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] Risk assessment tool--off brands
> >>
> >>
> >> What off-brand tape stocks would you consider to be at greater risk than
> >> the standard Ampex/Scotch products? Shamrock? Irish? I might add
> >> Sarkes-Tarzian. Are there others that are consistently problematic?
> >>
> >> Mike
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: Association for Recorded Sound Discussion List
> >> [mailto:ARSCLIST@xxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Scott D. Smith
> >> Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2006 1:36 PM
> >> To: ARSCLIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >> Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] Risk assessment tool
> >>
> >> To confirm Mike's findings, we have also encountered any number of
> >> "white box" second grade tapes, mostly from the mid-fifties to early
> >> seventies, which exhibit what may appear at first glance to be sticky
> >> shed, but in fact suffer from other manufacturing problems (which is why
> >> the ended up in the second grade bin!). Some of these may respond to
> >> baking, others may not. (We just recently did a whole batch of tapes
> >> recorded on 1/4" 1 1/2 mil.acetate stock from a company out of New York
> >> called Magna-Reel. The stock appears to be second grade Ampex 611, with
> >> very poor slitting and areas where the coating was applied unevenly, in
> >> addition to some stiction).
> >>
> >> Unlike stocks from Ampex, 3M, AGFA/BASF and others, whose
> >> characteristics have been well documented, the off-brand tapes are a
> >> challenge unto themselves. The tapes are seldom the same, even if they
> >> appear to be from the same batch, and vary wildly in both their physical
> >> and magnetic characteristics. All in all, a real nightmare for an
> >> archivist.
> >>
> >> My advice is to tread carefully, and don't do any treatment that may be
> >> irreversible. (It should go without saying that you should never attempt
> >> to bake an acetate/mylar based tape, but I thought it would bear
> >> repeating-just in case a novice is reading through these posts!)
> >>
> >> I would be most curious as to whether Bob could identify the two tapes
> >> that wouldn't respond to baking, though.
> >>
> >> Scott D.Smith
> >>
> >> Chicago Audio Works, Inc.
> >>
> >> Chicago, IL
> >>
> >> *****************************
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Mwcpc6@xxxxxxx wrote:
> >>
> >>> In a message dated 1/4/2006 11:33:25 AM Eastern Standard Time,
> >>> micasey@xxxxxxxxxxx writes:
> >>> Bob,
> >>>
> >>> I'm curious about the two sss tapes that baking did not restore--any
> >>> thoughts on what might have been different with those two tapes
> >>> compared to the countless others that were succesfully baked?
> >>>
> >>> Mike
> >>> ***************
> >>>
> >>> Not that it relates to Bob's case, but similar tapes that I've found
> >>> were green-box "Shamrock" reels in which the oxide did not seem sticky,
> >>
> >>
> >>> but partly smoothly transferred to the backing of the previous
> >>> layer, leaving effectively double coated tape.
> >>>
> >>> Considering the source, this may have represented a catastrophic
> >>> manufacturing defect that was passed on to the "white box" market.
> >>>
> >>> Mike Csontos
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
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> >>
> >
> >