Re: [ARSCLIST] Vanguard Classics reappears in 2 cd sets

[Tom Fine <tflists@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

Uh, no no and no.

First of all, the RCA's are selling very well for SACD's, as I understand it. In other words --  
niche product but doing very well in the niche. The family that controls BMG is in love with the RCA 
catalog and classical music, so there's corporate support beyond dollars and cents analysis there.

The CD layer of the Mercury's is the digital master made by my mother from a 3-2 mixdown right to 
the A-D converter. The 2-ch version on the SACD version is made in Germany. The whole point of the 
discs was to keep the original 3-2 mix beloved by critics and fans (and sold literally millions of 
units in the 1990s and continuing where in print to this day) and add the SACD element.

I personally think the SACD is much better suited to new original recordings. Listen to some of the 
5.1 SACD stuff being made in Europe. On the best, it's truly like you're there in the room with the 
orchestra or ensemble. Using SACD to do reissues runs into these problems:

-- bright spotlight on the original medium, where all the flaws and distortions are front and center
-- spreading the signal too thin just to get sound out of 5 speakers. For instance the Columbia 3-ch 
reissues of Miles Davis and Dave Brubeck, in my opinion, thin the sound out so it's much less 
pleasing than the original 2ch stereo or even the mono mixes.
-- remixing multi-track sources in a way probably not intended by the artists or original producers. 
Hokey effects like flying solos around the circle or overhead come to mind. On the other hand, the 
remix of "Layla" spreads the muddy sound out so you can more clearly pick out all the individual 
parts. Still very poorly recorded, but a little bit clear in 5 channels. No earlier-era multi-track 
remix I've heard holds together as cohesively as the stereo mix, but like I said sometimes a 
bad/crowded/muddy recording can benefit, although it then suffers from the first problem listed.

On the other hand, making SACD's from scratch -- with the intention of surround mixing from the 
start, and using the DSD digital system from the start -- yields a very fine product. The big 
downside is cost and there is little justification to run up much cost doing this since the business 
is moving inextricably to iPod type devices.

Here's my bottom line on all of this. I would like as much good material (good being a matter of 
opinion) that never saw a CD release to see a CD release before that medium submerges. I believe the 
iPod/MP3/AAC format is a very big step backward sound-wise and that a well-mastered CD can finely 
reproduce the good work of past engineers. So I don't want the record companies to bloat limited 
budgets with fringe formats for niche markets. That includes LPs and SACD's. I'd much rather they 
concentrate on the mainstream product and keep it healthy until the download model starts allowing 
for full-quality digi-files (Apple Lossless Format comes to mind, and a copy-protection wrapper 
layer should be doable for it just like it was doable for MP4/AAC). Indeed, I believe that a niche 
market may emerge for Higher-Quality downloads, even 96/24 files (assuming the original transfer was 
made that way, which is not true of most material that was released on CD). A person would pay, say, 
the same $20 they pay for a premium CD or 180g LP and download the audio, which they might play thru 
their hifi soundcard or burn to a DVD-A disc. But, again, that takes the focus off getting as much 
back-catalog released on CD as possible.

I wonder if there's enough market for the old classical stuff -- the great old recordings and 
performances, not a whole lot of forgettable old stuff just because it's old -- for someone to form 
a classical version of Mosaic. Do box sets with beautiful packaging, careful remastering and 
informative books lush with photos. You'd have to go back and see what parts of an artist or 
orchestra's work is the real gem. You'd have to mercilessly pair it down and you'd have to fight 
with notoriously snipey critics and chat-room-regulars about your choices. Hmmm, maybe not a good 
business plan after all.

-- Tom Fine

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Don Cox" <doncox@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <ARSCLIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Saturday, June 10, 2006 6:30 AM
Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] Vanguard Classics reappears in 2 cd sets


> Hello Scott
>
> On 10/06/06, Scott D. Smith wrote:
> > Tom,
> >
> > I got the same information a few years back about the films being in
> > Germany, although it wasn't really definative. This was prior to the
> > SACD project that Universal started.
> >
> > I never really got a straight answer on the Everest material, although
> > one person I spoke with was of the opinion that the films were in bad
> > shape (as in, the oxide was falling off the base). I was never able to
> > confirm this, but given the history of how many record companies have
> > dealt with their masters, I wouldn't be surprised.
> >
> > As you point out, SACD sales have been less than staller, so I don't
> > look for any interest on the parts of the record labels any time soon.
>
> Sony-BMG seem to be quite pleased with the sales of the Living Stereo
> SACDs, enough to have issued several batches. Last I heard, they are
> planning some opera reissues later this year.
>
> One difference is that BMG derived the CD layer from the SACD, and it
> sounds better than previous CD issues, while Universal used the previous
> CD transfer. So there was no incentive for anyone who doesn't yet have
> an SACD player to rebuy the Mercuries.
>
> I think that could have halved sales.
> > In regards to the Command material, I would once again be interested
> > specifically in the 3 track film masters for the L/C/R spread, as
> > opposed to the 2 channel mixdowns, even though they may at this point
> > be in better condition than the film originals.
> >
> > In any event, it's truly a shame that nothing is being done to
> > preserve what is left of the material (if any). (I am making an
> > assumption that whoever owns the rights haven't done anything).
> >
> > Although a market for the material may not exist at the moment, who
> > knows what might happen 50 years from now.
>
> Indeed.
>
> Consider the renewed interest in DG and Decca recordings from the 1950s
> - their "Original Masters" box sets have been very successful.
>
> Regards
> --
> Don Cox
> doncox@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx