This is why I urge institutions and collections to consider out- sourcing audio transfer to professionals if they don't have the skills or equipment in-house. Much better they specialize in cataloging, making available for public consumption and then digitally preserving (ie tending the hard disc farm, getting funding to keep it tended, migrating to new digital media when necessary, etc)
Furthermore, I can say pretty darn confidently that in many cases a collection or institution gets much more bang for the grant buck by outsourcing transfer and then taking care of the digital cleanup/ processing/slicing/dicing/preserving in-house.
Bottom line is, if you care about what's on a tape and there are signs the tape won't play correctly, you can't wish the problems away. You have to know what you're doing and take the proper measures or the tape can easily be ruined forever.
Best, John Spencer
John Spencer BMS/ Chace LLC 1801 8th Ave. S. Suite 200 Nashville, TN 37203 office (615) 385-1251 fax (615) 385-0153 cell (615) 714-1199 email: js@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx www.bridgemediasolutions.com
Hi Brandon:
Here's my last word on this. Unfortunately, wishes aren't horses, as they say. If you have a damaged tape and you don't take proper measures to un-damage it as best as possible, and then you try to play it, you will get nothing usable to preserve and you will ruin the tape. That is simply fact. This is why I urge institutions and collections to consider out-sourcing audio transfer to professionals if they don't have the skills or equipment in-house. Much better they specialize in cataloging, making available for public consumption and then digitally preserving (ie tending the hard disc farm, getting funding to keep it tended, migrating to new digital media when necessary, etc) than trying to wear too many hats. It's hard enough to have a staff that is truly expert in the collection and well versed in proper cataloging and preservation and public-availability methods -- that is a ton of expertise right there. Most places can't afford to then add another layer of audio transfer/analog format expert and still another layer of equipment-maintenance/fix-it expert. Furthermore, I can say pretty darn confidently that in many cases a collection or institution gets much more bang for the grant buck by outsourcing transfer and then taking care of the digital cleanup/processing/slicing/dicing/ preserving in-house. Why? It's hard on a grant-to-grant budget to keep the needed expertise in-house and harder still to keep fussy antique playback equipment in top condition. Thus, it's hard to be assured of a proper transfer on one pass or many passes -- with each pass further deteriorating the source material.
One man's opinion here ...
Bottom line is, if you care about what's on a tape and there are signs the tape won't play correctly, you can't wish the problems away. You have to know what you're doing and take the proper measures or the tape can easily be ruined forever.
-- Tom Fine
----- Original Message ----- From: "Brandon Burke" <burke@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <ARSCLIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, October 09, 2006 7:21 PM
Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] Tape baking question
Tom (and all),
Apologies if my response seemed harsh, i certainly wasn't directing anything
at you personally..
I do however think it's important for us to keep in mind the fact that a good
percentage of the readers on this list are not engineers but rather representatives of collecting
bodies (institutional or otherwise) trying to get a grip on how to manage their holdings.
With that in mind, and given our well-intentioned propensity to look at problems
from as many angles as possible, i fear that sometimes we have the tendency to dive
head-first into worst-case scenarios rather than looking at David's original post as a more
general problem.
To be sure, I haven't disagreed with anything you've offered to this discussion.
It is important to me, though, that we make this forum as helpful as possible to those without
the resources to, say, establish tape playback capabilities within a cold storage environment.
And that's all i'm going to say on that matter. Four posts in 24hrs is way over my limit. (hint hint..)
cheers, Brandon Burke
On Oct 9, 2006, at 3:08 PM, Tom Fine wrote:
Hi Brandon:
Who's talking about "delegitimizing" anything? That's what's bananas! Do whatever you want with your tapes, everyone, please. Hopefully they will play well and true and not be ruined with whatever processes you decide to employ. I'm just speaking as someone who has quite a bit of experience with problem tapes and I'm saying wait for advice from someone who I would consider expert in problem tapes. Anyone can do whatever they want, it's your tapes. Hopefully they won't get ruined (and if they do get ruined, hopefully they're not the tapes that contain that secret section of the Nixon tapes).
-- Tom Fine
----- Original Message ----- From: "Brandon Burke" <burke@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <ARSCLIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, October 09, 2006 4:44 PM
Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] Tape baking question
Some good (and certainly responsible) points here, but I feel
compelled to say that i'm uncomfortable with the idea that there
exists somewhere a *true* sticky shed, and that only tapes "bound together
until treated" qualify. This not only delegitimizes anything less than
over-the-top obvious hydrolysis, it also implies that (1) absolutely any
and every reel of poly tape, provided it contains at least one splice,
should be frozen before playback just in case the inner splice is sticky
and (2) we all have the option of freezing reels and playing them back
in a refrigerator.
That's bananas..
Brandon Burke
On Oct 9, 2006, at 3:32 AM, Tom Fine wrote:
Hi Brandon:
The problem is, there could well be parts of the tape pack that are stuck together (pinning and I forgot the other word Richard uses). So unrolling those parts before they are treated will destroy them (peel the oxide off). I asked Richard about this very type of reel before and if I recall the answer is freeze it and then play it cold (ie tape machine in a fridge) at very slow speed, which should unstick the bound portions enough to spool onto a reel for baking. The other parts, like 176, don't respond to baking and need the full cold treatment, if I recall. It's much more complicated that just spooling pieces off because true sticky- shed tape is probably bound together until treated and thus will be destroyed by spooling until it's treated.
Don't take what I say is gospel truth. Let Richard weigh in since he's done the research.
-- Tom Fine
----- Original Message ----- From: "Brandon Burke" <burke@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <ARSCLIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, October 09, 2006 1:52 AM
Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] Tape baking question
First of all, i mean not to steal Richard H's thunder, as he knows quite a bit more about this subject than me.
That said, it strikes me that the solution proposed here only accounts for splices *so* sticky as to be identifiable by touch alone. Thus allowing selections exhibiting less ridiculously obvious stages of hyrolysis to miss the boat.
Brandon Burke
Quoting Tom Fine <tflists@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>:
Guys, this is not all correct. Wait for Richard Hess to chime in.
----- Original Message ----- From: "David Lennick" <dlennick@xxxxxxxxxxxx> To: <ARSCLIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 10:38 PM Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] Tape baking question
> That was sort of what I expected the answer to be.
>
> dl
>
> "joe@xxxxxxxxxxx" wrote:
>
>> If memory serves, baking is known to be detrimental to some
types of
>> tape, so I'd suggest separating them out as best you can, bake,
>> reassemble and Xfer.
>>
>> Joe Salerno
>> Industrial Video Services
>> PO Box 273405
>> Houston Texas 77277-3405
>>
>> David Lennick wrote:
>> > Here's one for the team. Let's say you have a reel made up of
several short
>> > pieces of tape, either a compilation or a master or just
something
where it was
>> > convenient to group similar pieces of material together.
Let's say
SOME of the
>> > selections are recorded on 176, some on 456, some on god
knows
what....and of
>> > course, now you have a tape that has sticky shed on only
some of the
tracks. Do
>> > you bake the whole thing or try and remove only the portions
that
need
>> > treatment and bake them?
>> >
>> > --Stuck
>> >
-- Brandon Burke Archivist for Audio Collections Hoover Institution Archives Stanford University Stanford, CA 94305-6010 vox: 650.724.9711 fax: 650.725.3445 email: burke@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
____________________________________ Brandon Burke Archivist for Audio Collections Hoover Institution Archives Stanford University Stanford, CA 94305-6010 vox: 650.724.9711 fax: 650.725.3445 email: burke@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
____________________________________ Brandon Burke Archivist for Audio Collections Hoover Institution Archives Stanford University Stanford, CA 94305-6010 vox: 650.724.9711 fax: 650.725.3445 email: burke@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx